RatPalace.com - Pet Rat Care and Discussion

Sun Jan 04, 2004 9:22 am

I've already discovered that mice's needs are different than rats' for housing. Well, my mice, anyway, perhaps those of you longtime mouse owners can either confirm this or tell me otherwise.

Mice need proportionally more space than rats do! If rats and mice were the same size, you'd need a bigger cage for the mice. My rats had a huge, many-level mansion, 18" deep by 30" wide by 5 feet tall, and tons of free-range time. I believe the mice would prefer this as well, but since the rat cage bar spacing is too big, I can't use it for them.

Yoli, since she came to me sick, has always been slower than the other two, and seems content to eat a lot and waddle around; this may (I hope) change once she feels better. Crazy is simply addicted to the wheel, but I did catch her exploring both cages a few times. Thimble, though, seems to think it's all still way too small, and I wonder if this is because she had the entire restaurant to run around in and is now feeling cramped.

This is their little "palace":

Bad pic, but:
The cage on the right is a Hagen mouse-specific house, plastic on the ends and the bottom, small wire bars on the rest. It measures about 15" wide X 9" deep X 9" tall. It contains a weird plastic mushroom treehouse that hangs from the top bars, a bird loop perch, water bottle, and hanging seed treat thingie which they sometimes cling to and gnaw, quite fun to watch.

The cage on the left which I built measures 18" wide X 12" deep X 14" tall, with two half-levels. I had no more cage material left to put in a full second level, but after observing Thimble I discovered that having two half-levels instead wouldn't pose a problem since the drop from the topmost level was only about 8 inches -- not to mention that mice teleport themselves instantly from one spot to another in one millionth of a nanosecond anyway, all without using ramps.

In the wire cage is a minature tree stump house and water bottle on the top right level, the wheel is mounted to the side of the cage on the middle left level, and under the wheel level on the ground floor is a teeny litter box (too cute!) and water bottle. The miniature igloo (again, too cute!) and porch swing (a bird food cup hung from its side) are on the bottom right, as is the tube leading to the Hagen cage.

So, this all sounds great, no? Lots of stuff to play with and eat, a good amount of room ... I'd thought. I had been going to get two more mice cos I thought it might be good for them to interact in a more clan-like environment than just being the Three Stooges, and technically I think the space is big enough. But, it seems they're bored with it already. And they obviously can't have free range time like rats can, so that's a big minus.

I was thinking of building a holder, sort of a table frame, for above the Hagen cage, and putting in it another container, connecting it with more tubes to the Hagen. In it I'd put another wheel, water bottle, nesting space, and any other toys I can think up. This would be approximately the same size as the Hagen, thereby doubling that space. Five mice would have no problem in all this space with three cages, it's the interest I'm worried about. Thimble needs to roam more and have interesting things to explore, so I'm also going to get extra tubes for inside the wire cage, and make mazes or tunnels for her. Or, Nitram can get a mouse-sized version of dryer hose from work, which might be nice for inside the cage since if it gets chewed, no one escapes.

What does anyone think? Is it more and more space, or more and more toys/mazes, or a little of both that I need? Any thoughts are appreciated.

_________________
Kate & the M.O.U.S.
If you saw a man drowning and you could either save him or photograph the event ... what kind of film would you use?
~ Anonymous

Sun Jan 04, 2004 8:00 pm

Kate, I honestly have no clue about your questions. I've never had mice and don't know a darn thing about them. Without knowing anything, the cage looks great to me! You did a nice job of building it. I'll be Monique can give you some good advice when she sees this.

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Christy
RP Admin
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Frodo, Zorro, Erzulie, Maeve, Clara, Molly & Emily

Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:32 am

Charlie is packing his belongings to come and live at your place! His tank is 24 inches wide x 14 inches deep x 16 inches high, with 4 levels. He has nest boxes and tubes and various bits of wood with holes to climb in and on and chew on. And his precious wheel, of course. He has always seemed pretty contented, but now he knows about your mouse mansion I suspect he won't be for long!

One thing that might entertain your mice, Kate, if they haven't got it already, is loads of shredded paper - like strips of paper towels. Charlie loves it, and spends hours constructing it into towers and making complex nests.

_________________
Linda and the RMDs

Many have forgotten this truth but you must not forget it. We remain responsible forever, for what we have tamed.
Antoine de Saint-Exupery.

Mon Jan 05, 2004 9:10 am

Wow, I'm liking you Kate. I was sort of noticing the same thing with my newbies but hadn't put my finger on what I was observing compared to the last time I had mice.
This is my third round of having mice as pets, but I'm certainly no expert since most were held in various states of knowledge. My first round was as a teenager, when my Mom made me keep the mice in our heated outbuilding. Much like you have now, I connected an old Habitrail to an aquarium and those to a large outdoor rabbit cage via tubing out a hole in the wall. Though they obviously had lots of space, they were always searching and loved boxes filled with leaves or straw I'd put in the outdoor section. That's been so long ago I had forgotten about them.
My second set of mice was about five years ago, but they were always rather sluggish in comparison to the former or current mice.
The current mice seem much more active and inquisitive, which leads me to believe that maybe it's more of what's in the space than how large the space is. I'm sure they do like exploring new spaces though, so if your like me and you like building and adding on, the mice should appreciate it.

Right now the girls are in a fifteen gallon tank (24"x12"x12") with a tube leading to a tower on top. Inside I have their wheel, a forked stick from the yard propped up for climbing and a little box of tissues I just added. If the male gets neutered, his cage can be attached. It is a lot like the Hagen cage you have. I just saw that Hagen cage at the pet shop the other day. It is kind of neat that they finally make some things just for mice. Looks like they were going after the Stuart Little fans.

Mon Jan 05, 2004 10:06 am

Unscented toilet paper makes good bedding. It shreds easily and is cheaper than paper towels, and softer for the little ones to sleep in.

Sounds like a mouse palace in the making. Wish more people looked after their animals like people on this forum. You wouldnt believe some of the things people keep mice in.....

Kate, we need photots of the palace when its completed.

If you get desperate for a solid wheel for your girls I could send you one, I started manufacturing them here a few years ago but they didnt sell. The solid wheels are better for their little feets, and it helps keep the toe nails down, you dont want to clip their toe nails, they are SO TINY, its nerve wracking stuff and I always get the giggles which doesnt help at all.

Monique

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The world would be a happier place if there were no mirrors.

Mon Jan 05, 2004 10:23 am

So I think it's a bit of both: more space, and waaaaaay more toys.

Well, of course I need more space to fit more toys, so it'll be a never-ending project!

I buy them that soft unbleached cotton bedding, I think it's called Bed Fluff, and they love it. I also shred a paper towel and stick the bits through the cage bars so they have to work to get them. They're wonderful nest-builders, they weave the towel bits and Carefresh and cotton fluff into the cutest little cocoons.

Monique, why don't you put your wheels for sale in the Flea Market forum!

_________________
Kate & the M.O.U.S.
If you saw a man drowning and you could either save him or photograph the event ... what kind of film would you use?
~ Anonymous

Mon Jan 05, 2004 8:08 pm

	lauramouse wrote:
	you dont want to clip their toe nails, they are SO TINY, its nerve wracking stuff

I couldn't even imagine clipping Charlie's toe nails, even if he were tame and could be handled. Every time I watch him I marvel at how tiny his feet are - I don't think I can even see his nails!
I guess I've always assumed that his solid wheel and the various wooden things he has to explore would keep his nails down.

_________________
Linda and the RMDs

Many have forgotten this truth but you must not forget it. We remain responsible forever, for what we have tamed.
Antoine de Saint-Exupery.